When seated on a plane next to a decompensating four-year-old whose father was totally weary, I asked if I might tell him a story. When the exhausted parent agreed, I told him Rikki-tikki-tambo and made it so very long that he was totally calm thereafter. Then I told him other stories. Maybe people in front of and behind me didn't care for the stories, but I think we all would have cared less for his screaming. As for the dad, I know a look of pure, profound gratitude when I see it!--A Grandma Herself

Posted By a grandmother on January 17, 2008, 12:15 PM

I disagree with Ray about not tipping the waitstaff. It's not the fault of the server that a patron's brat is acting up, unless they are actually giving them the sugar packets to toss around (or whatever the case may be). I'm sure the server would like the child bound & gagged as much as you do.

Posted By Lisa B on January 17, 2008, 12:18 PM

What kind of a nitwit is this Ray person? Since when is it the responsibility of a waiter/server to discipline somebody else's children? Many restaurant owners are too cheap to pay their staff a living wage. Why should a server be punished because some parents weren't sterilized in time?

Posted By Florence on January 17, 2008, 12:44 PM

Alyssa's comment brings about fond memories of when I was a kid. I am one of 6 kids, and we rarely went out to eat because my parents simply couldn't afford it. We were traveling once, and when we all got up to leave the restaurant, a fellow patron said to my parents, "What wonderful children you have. They're all so well behaved." My mother just glowed the rest of the evening.

Posted By Greg on January 17, 2008, 12:44 PM

I wish parents would take an interest in THEIR CHILDREN . But in this day and age it seems that the PARENTS ARE THE CHILDREN

Posted By bigbear on January 17, 2008, 1:01 PM

HA! If any of my brothers & I, EVER acted-up in a restaurant that we were so lucky to go to, my father threatened to"PULL OUR PANTS DOWN and,SPANK US", if we ever acted-up !! Now a days, I suppose;child advocates & any other child protection agency, would probably have put my father in jail,for taking care of HIS RESPONSIBILITY!TAKE HEED, IRRISPONSIBLE PARENTS !!! :-)

Posted By Mark on January 17, 2008, 1:12 PM

When I feel the need to speak to misbehaving children I address them as either gentleman or ladies as in "excuse me gentleman." That usually stops them dead in their tracks because they usually hear, hey kids, knock that off. Not only do I get their attention but I'm addressing them with respect and in return, I get theirs. If it's just one child, I say "excuse me sir" which may seem formal, but it gets the same results.

Posted By Shannon on January 17, 2008, 1:19 PM

I agree it is not the waitstaffs responsibility to keep the kids under control but there are three things they can do to make everybody happy.
1. Bring some crackers, olives, etc.. as soon as the kids arrive,
2. Bring some coloring
3. Let the family order as soon as they sit down.

I guarantee this will get bigger tips, clear your tables quickly and make everyone happier.

Posted By Eric on January 17, 2008, 1:32 PM

When I was a server in a "family" restaurant, often parents would let their little sweethearts (ages 0-12) crawl around on the floor where I had to walk. This infuriated me! Not only was it VERY dangerous for the child (I was often carrying 50 pound trays of many breakable plates and steaming hot food), but it was dangerous for me and slowed down my service. If there was a child in my way, after nicely requesting that the parents keep their children seated at the table, I eventually would just kick the offender. Worked every time.

Posted By Vanessa on January 17, 2008, 1:38 PM

The biggest problem I see with children in restaurants and on airplanes is that the parents don't provide anything for the children to do BUT bother other people! I always carried a bag packed with quiet toys and books that the kids only saw on special occasions. They would hurry to sit quietly so that they could play with these special items. On a budget? Visit a dollar store! For $10 you can eke out hours of quiet by doling out the items one by one. I also gave away a few books and toys just to get other kids to be quiet. We have 3 kids and have travelled often and only gotten compliments which we really, really appreciate.

Posted By Experienced Mom on January 17, 2008, 1:58 PM

MY SONS ARE NOW 19 & 20 AND EVEN BEING JUST REGULAR KIDS THEY STILL HAD MANNERS. IT'S THE PARENTS FAULT. KICK THEM OUT, OFF OR DOUBLE THEIR BILL IN ADVANCE. IN TODAYS WORLD, INSTEAD OF ONE'S ON PRIDE IT SEEMS TO TAKE SOMETHING MORE TO DO THE RIGHT THING. SHAME

Posted By SHANNON on January 17, 2008, 2:01 PM

I agree with Ray that one of the jobs of the restaurant staff is to keep the patrons comfortable. If there is a parent who is allowing a child to disrupt the other patrons, that parent should be asked to put an end to the behavoir or leave with the child.
I have children and also can't stand it when other people's kids try to show me a toy or have a conversation with me. They need to be amused by their parent, not me or any other stranger.

Posted By KarenB on January 17, 2008, 2:06 PM

Ime a flight attendant with 30 years of high time in , both domestic and international. The number one cause of "kid splatter" on aircraft is parents or guardians who do not take the time to bring stuff to occupy the child. Dollar store is a great idea , but how about the kids room? Most american kids have way more toys than they can use. Take 3 minutes to scoop up some toys and don't forget the drawing stuff. DVD players are the best but make sure you have headphones as many airlines do not allow the speakers to be used in flight as it drives every one else around you crazy. Also , make sure you have extra batteries and that the machine works before you pack it. Airlines do not have power adapters, batteries or babysitters on board. If you are being driven crazy by a child on board, it is up to you to discreetly request that the child's guardian control the kid.Flight attendants have no way to make parents or guardians do that, but you ( their fellow passenger ) do. A polite request goes a long way. Mom may not realize Little Johnny has been kicking your seat for 3 hours or drumming on the tray table attached to your seat back for the last twelve hundred miles.
A little bit of empathy goes a long , long way. Its really hard to travel with little kids ( I have some )and an airplane is not he family station wagon of your youth where Dad could pull over and give you a good spanking or let you go for a quick run when you started to lose it. People, remember, its public transportation.
If you cannot deal with your fellow humans, charter your own plane.

Posted By blake on January 17, 2008, 2:33 PM

It is too bad that in today's society patience is not one of our strong suits. I agree that it is the parents' responsibility to discipline if the child acts up and is disruptive I do not agree that if a child is friendly and sociable and shows someone their toy or says hello they need to be disciplined.

Posted By momof2 on January 17, 2008, 2:35 PM

I completely agree that parents are responsible for amusing their children and keeping them in line, but some of these comments are getting a bit ridiculous. A good, friendly attitude goes a very long way towards spreading good will. Is it really such a problem for you that my child said hi or showed you a toy? Just because he's not old enough to buy you a drink doesn't mean that manners are not required on your part.

Please remember you're teaching children about the world with your demeanor, as well. Teach them that it's a friendly, fun, valuable place and maybe they'll grow up to cure your nasty terminal illness or find the solution for global climate change.

Posted By Amanda on January 17, 2008, 3:05 PM

Do others find that the failure to train children to behave is unique, or at least disproportionate, to parents from the US? I see European parents traveling with small children all over the world, and the kids don't seem to act out in the same way. Is this just one more manisfestation of the loud, inconsiderate US tourist?

Some parents actually seem unaware that their is any problem with their children acting out. Several years ago I was in a long, multinational check-in line in a hotel in Bangbok. A girl, about 4 years old, was running around the perimeter of the lobby SCREAMING. I wouldn't have known whose child she was except that the man in front of me gave me a look that said "isn't she cute?" I 'responded' by commenting to the woman behind me that I was astonished how some parents saw absolutely no need to control their children. That kid was stopped and silent in seconds. Or the woman on an airplane who disdainfully told her husband that she could tell I wasn't a mother because of the way I looked at her child during his extended high-pitched shriek. I'm still coming up with things I should have said to her.

Posted By Gabrielle on January 17, 2008, 3:10 PM

I agree, what is so bad about a child coming up to say hello to you? The people that are so disturbed by this might want to pull the stick out of their rear end and realize that they aren't the only person in the world. Think of a child who gets told off for being friendly, what does that teach them? Would you tell off an adult that comes and says hello to you?

Also, as I worked as a waitress in a family restaurant through high school AND university, I highly disagree with not tipping your waitress. They are usually too busy to babysit someone else's children and when making only $2 an hour, they shouldn't be penalized because there are bratty kids around. If you are so put off by this, tell the parents to control the child yourself.

Posted By Kristin on January 17, 2008, 3:26 PM

I have to disagree that it's only American children whose behavior isn't being controlled by parents. I'm sorry to say we've seen it in a number of countries. Recently while in Istanbul, my husband and I decided to splurge and have one drink in the lovely Four Seasons bar -- at a cost of $42. In the nearby glassed-in restaurant, 8 adults were having dinner, and they allowed three young children to run around the bar area, chasing each other and shouting. Needless to say, the otherwise beautiful atmosphere was marred for us. A few weeks later, we were on a thankfully short flight from Barcelona to Valencia when a group of young adults just behind us not only allowed four children to continually shriek and shout, but actually encouraged them and joined into the noisy exchanges. None of the children in either incident was American.

Posted By Barbara on January 17, 2008, 4:03 PM

Children who misbehave in public is something that has bothered me for a long time, way before I had my own children. So when the time came, we made a point of "teaching" our children appropriate public behavior. This included regular "burger fryday" trips for dinner for the expressed purpose of learning to behave in public. Just one rule, if any of the three children could not be respectful to other diners, we would leave. It didn't matter where we were in the meal, I would simply pay the bill and instruct the children to gather their belongings it was time to leave. Believe it or not, we only had to leave twice before the lesson was learned. A third incident was averted when the two older children cautioned my youngest with "You had better stop that. She's not kidding, we'll get up and leave." It wasn't easy as I was usually dining alone with three children under the age of 5. Many times I heard audible sighs from other patrons as the four of us were seated near them. More often than not these same individuals would stop by our table and comment on how well behaved the children were. Everyone smiled politely and said their thank you's. I of course, beamed with pride.

Posted By Jana on January 17, 2008, 4:39 PM

A SUMMARY:
The comments above are excellent with two main exceptions (notably in the "tips themselves) that have been covered, but I think a summary is in order:

Parents: your children are out in public, hopefully you are teaching then to go out in public on their own in the future, to be citizens, and to act accordingly; you had them, it is your job to keep them occupied and keep their "roar" to a reasonable level - not flight attendants, not waitstaff, not anyone but you.

Others: children are not yet adults, cut them some slack, and cut their frazzled parents some too (we all know how difficult travel can be at times), a screaming baby on an airplane that is making its ears pop is to be pitied, not scorned; a child that wants to show you his favorite truck is precious, not a bother (assuming the parent doesn't decide that you are that child's new babysitter for the next half hour).

We are all on this planet together, a little tolerance, patience, and understanding for each others' situations can go a long way.

Posted By Eve Sorenson on January 17, 2008, 4:41 PM

I really wonder if any of the comments above were made by people who have actually had kids. As much as I would love for my kids to be perfect 24-7, they are not; some times no matter how I try. When you see that child crying or yelling, whether in a restaurant, plane, or other public place, try to think as if you were in the parent's shoes. This may be that parent's only time in the past 2 weeks that they have even been out of the house or their first trip in 2 years. Sometimes we don't know how our children will behave until we are actually there, like on a plane. Most parents do everything they can to keep their kids quiet and under control in public, but sometimes ignoring them is the only way for them to stop. If you yell at them, they are getting attention, even if it is negative, so they yell louder to get your attention again. So, please be nice to our children. Let's not scar them for life. If you want to be helpful, try to distract them from whatever they are upset about. Sometimes they just need someone to change the subject and they forget.

Posted By Leah on January 17, 2008, 4:53 PM

I certainly don't believe that the wait-staff is responsible for ill-behaved children, but I do have one more thing to add to Eric's suggestions:
The wait-staff should bring the bill as soon as the family looks to be nearing the end of the meal. I know that as my children run out of food they will get bored and want to leave. How torturous it is to have to wait another 20 minutes for the bill while trying to entertain the children! Last time this happened I simply left with the baby and left my husband behind with my son. They got the hint and our bill was paid in a matter of minutes.

Also, I don't mind a child saying hello, but I certainly don't like being interrupted or continually badgered by a child at a nearby table. The last time we were in Red Robin the girl in the booth behind us continued to talk to my family once our food arrived and even asked for my fries! Now that was what I call rude.

Posted By Anna on January 17, 2008, 5:02 PM

I definitely find that American children are less well-behaved than those of many other countries; however, that said, all you have to do is ride a bus as Disneyworld to see ill behaved children of every nationality. The cause, I'm sure is overstimulation, lack of parental involvement and parents refusal to use every moment with their children as a teaching moment! When is the last time you had a child get up and offer you a seat in a bus - I know when my was but it wasn't in this country! Parents, discipline your kids properly and teach them sensitivity and manners - its your job!

Posted By Margot Peter on January 17, 2008, 5:20 PM

How can we ever expect children to learn self control enought to sit in a classroom all day if the parents cannot make them sit for 40 minutes in a restaurant or airplane? Instead, we label these wild children ADD and give them drugs to calm them down in school. The only ADD most of these kids have is Adult Discipline Disorder!
My son was rather hyper when young, but we did the bag of toys, books, crayons and paper whereever we went (shopping, restaurants, doctors' offices, planes, etc) and he would calm down and sit for hours reading and drawing. He became an excellent writer and an amazing artist!
It also teaches them to be self reliant and not needing constant attention from others. Children are not being instilled any self control and are overindulged and given in to every tantrum. Is it any wonder we have so many violent young adults, they are just throwing tantrums with guns and fists.

Posted By Isabelle on January 17, 2008, 7:21 PM

Well, unlike Barbara in Istanbul, I wouldn't spend $42 for two drinks in the "lovely Four Seasons". Last night, I spent $45 for buffalo chicken tenders and eight potent drinks, and tip, by myself, forgive my extravagance. Yeah, speak nicely to the kids (of which I have none), and maybe say that if there's a lot of noise it spoils peoples' fun, and give the kids some simple tips about stuff. Regional jet from Chicago to Albany, a tot was screaming like someone was cutting his arm off, before takeoff. A flight attendant, who he'd never seen before, picked him up and walked him for two minutes. He didn't say boo for the rest of the flight. The touch of honey.

Posted By Bruce on January 17, 2008, 7:42 PM

And they won't let you take well-behaved dogs on planes! I can guarantee the behavior of my canines over a child anytime!

Posted By Meg on January 17, 2008, 8:37 PM

On a recent plane trip with my son and his family, I visited the dollar store and purchased several gifts for my 3 grandchildren and wrapped them. The children were told if they were good for a certain length of time they could pick out a gift. Somehow wrapping them made the gifts "extra-special and they were good as gold.

Posted By Kathleen on January 17, 2008, 10:55 PM

Yes, we all need to be kinder and gentler. However, bottom line, if a parent isn't doing his job of controlling the behavior of his little darlings, the manager/flight attendant or other person of authority needs to insist the parent do his duty. In a restaurant, theatre etc. the child should be taken out. In a plane there is not much you can do other than speak to the parent and hope he makes an attempt at correcting the behavior of an unruly child.

Posted By Jackie on January 17, 2008, 11:48 PM

I don't mind a child coming over to say "hi" in a restaurant. I do mind when they want to stay for an extended conversation. What are these parents thinking? With child molesters and kidnappers out there, do you really want your kid talking to someone you don't know?

Posted By Jen on January 18, 2008, 12:46 AM

Children understand more than we usually give them credit for. I recommend speaking directly to the child - respectfully but at his/her level. For instance, "Your shouting hurts my ears. Would you please be quiet?"

1. It reinforces to the child that his actions are bothering people.

2. If you make sure the parent overhears, the parent will likely discipline the child just as much or more than if you'd only commented directly to the parent.

Posted By Suzanne on January 18, 2008, 1:10 AM

Leah-Read Isabelle's posting.

Posted By Rod on January 18, 2008, 1:31 AM

i had my son at 19yrs., many would have considered me a child. i ALWAYS received compliments on how well-behaved my son was. i even got compliments when i thought he was misbehaving...?! i never thought i did anything extraordinary to discipline my son, just took extra steps to be considerate to the people around us. lucky for me, my son was naturally calm and patient. with that said, my son is also naturally social and not shy. and when my son said a simple "hi" to an "adult" (and i'll use that term lightly) and didn't get the respect and consideration to be responded to, i made sure that i taught him that there are RUDE, EVIL people out in the world and to be very careful not to interact with everybody. i'm sure you children-haters would appreciate that, now, my child is less-likely to speak to you but MY GOD! what a terrible, unfriendly world this has become where we teach our children that it is not okay to say a passing "hello" to someone.
I AM THOROUGHLY DISGUSTED that i share this planet with you people. PLEASE! do us all a favor: don't procreate- i'd hate more of you ruining the goodwill of man.

Posted By Michelle on January 18, 2008, 6:57 AM

I was traveling for business and on my way home. The flight was 2.3 hours. A couple and their two children, approx. ages 6 & 8, managed to get one upgrade for two in FC, and the other two remainded in general seating. The PARENTS took the first class seats, leaving their ill behaved kids to torture the rest of us with their screaming, fighting, racing up and down the aisle and throwing food around. Many of us said something to the attendants who refused to take action. Finally i said that i'd report the behavior BY THE STAFF to the FAA, starting with the pilots, when we landed. (The parents had been indifferent by their absence) VOILA, the parents were reunited, one to one, with their kids with an hour left on the flight. Kids aren't always sweet (I have four grown and three grands that i love) because they aren't always well-parented.

Posted By Lois O'Keefe on January 18, 2008, 8:11 AM

I took a New Years cruise that had many wealthy families that were not from the US. They were traveling without their nannies and not accustomed to handling their children. These youngster ran rampant througout the ship. The parents threw diapers into the septic system clogging and shutting down entire sections of the ship even after being told not to. The children played hand held video games in the theater during shows, distrating other guests. Finally, they disarmed all the fire extinquishers. The captain made an announcement that if the parents did not corral their children and change their own behavior they would all be taken off the ship at the next port.

All was well after that!

A crying infant at takeoff and landing is to be expected. Their ears hurt and they are too young to chew gum.

A child should not be wandering a restaurant alone to be able to come to my table to show me their toy or say hi. If they do so as they are passing my table with their parents, I will smile and say hi back. If they are seated near me and I am waiting for my meal, I will respond. If I am eating, I expect their parents to educate their child - don't bother the lady, she is eating.

Children are as well behaved as parents educate them to be. When my 3 yr old granddaughter starts to lose it in public we distract her and have taught her the "silent" or "indoor" scream. She gets her point across to us, but doesn't bother other people.

Posted By Ina Lentz on January 18, 2008, 8:48 AM

Leah said: "If you want to be helpful, try to distract them from whatever they are upset about."

Um, no... that's the point. It's YOUR job as the parent to discipline and distract your own child. Not my job as the hapless person who happened to get seated near you.

As for those talking about how to deal with children who approach you to show their toy or whatever... yes, if a child comes up politely to you, you should be polite back to them. But if I am only showing a polite disinterest... the parent should step up and steer the child elsewhere. Some people would be delighted to see their latest coloring masterpiece, others wouldn't - but it's up to the *parent* to be able to read the patron's body language and such to determine if their child's attention is desired.

I don't know how many times I've been sitting in a lobby or wherever trying to read and some kid will ask me 10 million questions. I politely answer back and then glance at the parents and they are almost always just smiling like 'aww, isn't that cute?' or completely ignoring the kid. I'll be polite the kid, but I think it is rude of the parent to assume I have nothing better to do with my time than to entertain their child for them.

Posted By Kat on January 18, 2008, 9:23 AM

I agree that people should watch their kids. But I also have been in FAMILY oriented restaurants and people looked irritated that kids there at like 5:30 PM were making some noise. If you want the cheap prices and you eat early, guess what? You're going to be with KIDS. We try to bring our kids early to the nicer restaurants. Our kids have learned to behave and we get compliments all the time. When they were little, we took them outside immediately if they misbehaved. It takes time and attention to teach them to behave in public.

Posted By Lynne Thompson on January 18, 2008, 11:16 AM

My "kids" are now teenagers, but we have been travelling and eating out with them since they were babies. We always believed WE were responsible for their behavior and have frequently been complimented on their good behavior and the fact they ate their meals!!

The key, for parents who claim "kids will be kids," is practice. Starting when they were tiny we practiced our good manners at meal time. We ate mac & cheese in the dining room on good plates with napkins on our laps, etc. I bet many misbehaving kids aren't used to sitting at a table to eat!

We bought our children seats on the plane even as infants and strapped them in to their car seats, which they were accustomed to. We never had a problem, except when the airline tried to make us give up their paid seats for overbooked flights.

Our kids would look at us with wide eyes when other children acted out in public. They knew that we knew where the "time out" spaces were no matter where we were in the world. I've seen lots of parents who needed a "time out" because their behavior toward their children just escalated the acting out.

When we took our then 6 & 8 year olds on a 15 hour non-stop flight the other passengers were grinning in the waiting area as we found a corner and had the kids doing jumping jacks, marching in place, etc., to work off energy before boarding. And bless the airline that immediately handed out small, quiet toys, art kits, and a children's menu, emphasizing their willingness to get us whatever we needed whenever we needed it during the flight.

All this was a lot of work all the time, not just when travelling, but it made all our lives so much easier.

Posted By Montana Mom on January 18, 2008, 12:02 PM

What is "blake," the flight attendant, smoking? "If you are being driven crazy by a child on board, it is up to you to discreetly request that the child's guardian control the kid. Flight attendants have no way to make parents or guardians do that, but you ( their fellow passenger ) do."

Disobeying flight attendants, even a mild challenge to an unreasonable demand, seems to be a federal offense now. You can't have it both ways.

It is not my responsibility as a passenger to maintain an orderly, stress free flight. It is not up to me to contain the aggressive drunk. It is not up to me to control the kid kicking my seat as hard as they can. Blake, and others with this "authority," if a parent won't control the kid use the same "voice" and potential police presence at the arrival gate with the parent.

Posted By Ray on January 18, 2008, 12:29 PM

I am not sure if there is only one "Ray" posting here, but your comment marked 12:29 on 1/18 regarding a flight attendant doing his or her job is bang on. But it is very different from your(?) original "tip" about refusing to tip.

The difference: your typical waitstaff has no control or time to deal with this situation, although often the manager of a restaurant would have little more. The best you can do is inform the manager (again, not the waitstaff) that you will not be patronizing the restaurant again (or writing a bad online review, etc.) if the problem is not resolved to the best of the restaurant's ability. (The suggestion of bringing the check immediately was excellent.)

The difference is that it is a part of the flight attendant's job to keep a flight orderly, so, depending on the complained-of behavior, a flight attendant CAN step in. As mentioned by Ray, and probably seen by many of us, a flight attendant can deal with unruly drunks, why not with misbehaving children?

Posted By Eve Sorenson on January 18, 2008, 2:09 PM

So many of these comments are utterly laughable. No matter where you go, you run the risk of sharing space with other people who you find annoying. Sometimes they will be children. Sometimes they will be adults.

I don't think that misbehaving children is unique to the US, but I do believe that the "I am the center of the universe and it's all about MEEEE" attitude so many of these comments exhibit is. Just because you scrimped and saved for your $300 flight or are having a "nice" dinner doesn't mean that the world revolves around your Very Special Experience. If dealing with the annoyances that come with being around other people is a problem for you, I suggest you arrange private transportation (chartered luxury jet) or dinner parties at home where you can control the guest list.

I will continue to be embarrassed when my 1-year-old makes too loud of a noise in public, and will continue to work to teach him the proper way to behave. But I will also continue to take him out in public--that's the only way he will learn the proper way to behave.

Posted By redpanda on January 18, 2008, 2:33 PM

I recently accompanied my daughter to have bloodwork done on her infant son. We waited an excruciatingly long time at the doctor's office and were told to return for the resuts in half an hour. We were famished, the baby was hungry and sick miserable but we HAD to get something to eat, our blood sugar was low and the baby needed to eat. No fast-food in this town, so we went to a pizza place. Freezing outside, so we went in to eat. Poor Jack screamed, the patrons were upset, the wait staff was angry, so I walked the baby around and showed him how to stack paper cups. he eventually calmed down and when the food came he felt better. Sometimes you just have no choice. Please don't judge someone until you've walked in their shoes.

Posted By Rennie Miller on January 18, 2008, 6:48 PM

I think this is part of the problem people have lost site of letting kids be kids. I totally agree with disciplining children if they are misbehaving but parents somewhere along the line have lost the ability to discipline their children. Child services is at your door in a heart beat if you dare to spank your child in public. We as a society have created our own problems. If you don't want to be disturbed then don't take public transportation.

Posted By TRACY on January 18, 2008, 8:06 PM

We were all children once -- let us not forget.

Posted By Kim on January 18, 2008, 9:08 PM

Redpanda says: "I don't think that misbehaving children is unique to the US, but I do believe that the "I am the center of the universe and it's all about MEEEE" attitude so many of these comments exhibit is. Just because you scrimped and saved for your $300 flight or are having a "nice" dinner doesn't mean that the world revolves around your Very Special Experience." Well Redpanda - you are totally incorrect. If I saved for months for a special dinner out or a vacation then I expect to enjoy my experience. It is the parent's obligation to make sure that their children are not disruptive, because guess what - I DESERVE to have a nice experience. The ME attitude that you are talking about here is YOU. You think it is okay to have disruptive children and those that scrimp and save to have a nice experience should just shut up is ridiculous.

As far as the infants' ears popping, when I traveled with my then 6 year old and his 1 year old sister I packed a backpack for the boy with new little toys/coloring books (although looking out the window was his favorite pasttime) and I made sure that the baby was hungry and would feed her when we started to take off and then land. The sucking on the bottle prevented her ears from popping. I NEVER had a problem with any of my children in restaurants or on planes or in other public places because they knew I wouldn't put up with it (and their butts would be toast).

Posted By Marianne on January 18, 2008, 11:00 PM

Reading Leah's comment, I realized she missed the point - ignoring your child's screaming so they'll stop? How many times have you seen that work - it generates louder screaming. And pity the poor parent who hasn't been out for 2 weeks? What about those parents who haven't been out for 2 weeks but haven't brought their children b/c they want to have a nice nite out without children demanding and causing commotions. My grown son, his fiance, her mother and I went to a "family oriented" ranch for a very expensive w/e where children were king - they ran rampant in the dining room, were disruptive & running around late at nite at the "adult" show (some blue language),and knocked into adults in public areas.We spent $2000 for two and a half days of nightmare experiences. Parents even lied about their children's riding experience so the parent wouldn't have to go on a slower ride - not only dangerous for the child but everyone suffered b/c the child couldn't keep up.I would never go there again & have told others not to go. Children need to learn how to behave before going out in public - it starts at home folks - and no, I don't feel I have to entertain your child in a restaurant after I've worked a 60 hour week.

Posted By Judith Ann Williams on January 20, 2008, 1:29 AM

I love kids, but if a child comes up to my table in a restaurant, for whatever reason, that means s/he has gotten out of his or her seat and walked over to my table. Where are the parents while this is happening? Even a very small child is capable of learning not to leave their own space and invade the space of others. This is not only proper etiquette, but an issue of safety for small children. Small children should not be so unattended they are able to initiate conversations with total strangers.

As for using the excuse of not being able to discipline your child in public because of fear someone will report you, please! No one will ever report you for instantly removing your baby or small child from a public space to take them outside so you can comfort them or help them get regain their balance. There's nothing that quiets a kid down faster than losing their audience. How well I remember standing in front of a church or restaurant alone with the tall adult who had just removed me from public view! Usually not much more needed to be said and we returned to the situation once I got recentered. At one time, this was the norm. Parents did not attempt to comfort or discipline their children at the expensive of others. They removed them instantly and were usually back with a calm child within minutes.

I see small children all the time in overstimulating environments. We seem to have lost any understanding of the fact that the nervous system of a child under the age of three isn't up to the impact of a shopping mall, movie or many other public venues. We take them to places that are full of sound, movement and colour stimulation that adults can barely cope with and wonder why they lose it.

I trust the family of the sick baby explained to the other patrons the baby was ill and unable to help herself. This is an exceptional situation, but all too often I see parents with children in overstimulating or boring places who refuse to give up a moment of their fun to remove their child for a few minutes.

As a former waitress, I totally disagree about the nature of that job. It was my JOB to ensure my patrons have a pleasant dining experience. If a child acted up and I was too chicken to approach the parents myself, I would go to the manager. Either way, it certainly isn't the job of other diners to deal with the situation, nor would I want them to do so. We don't usually have diners wandering the dining room to get their own ketchup or silverware. As a professional I certainly wouldn't want to take the risk they'd escalate the situation. Also, if we're trying to teach small children not to invade the space of other diners, it certainly won't do to set an example of having other diners approach the family directly.

Best wishes to all.

Posted By Sherry on January 21, 2008, 10:54 AM

I am most certainly not one who enjoys confrontations.

Loud/crying children are dealt with in the same manner as very loud and vulgar gaggle of teenage girls on what seems like an endless flight, a nice pair of $29.99 headphones. From what I read here the suggestions made to alert the attendant staff to get them involved, to me just seems unrealistic, on a full flight there is only so much ANYONE can do. It is not a store where I can just "remove" myself from the situation.

Curious toddlers who likes to crawl in between seats of even parachute overhead are welcomed. I play with them when I'm in the mood, or at least smile at them when they do their peek-a-boo routine before burying myself back into the reading material.

The problem I have yet to figure out how to solve is what do to about the "Geoffrey's" out there. During a recent flight from OGG to LAX (5 hrs) I was seated in front of a boy who's name is forever embedded into my memory. He looked around somewhere between the ages of 2-4 years old. Quiet as a church mouse but with the legs of professional football player, he certainly had the stamina of a pro ball athlete. Using the back of my seat as his target, I felt like I was under siege.

His mother was very apologetic and trying very hard to get the little boy to stop but just as she was settling back into her own seat after finishing apologizing again, the barrage would start again. The mother tried everything from ordering, pleading, bribing, cajoling, and threatening dear Geoffry, No Deal.

Finally, the "father?" of the group took Geoffry for a walk. Whow! Where did HE come from? What was he doing for the last 2 hours? Did the man really just sat next to her and let the mother deal unsuccessfully this whole time? I was somewhat flabbergasted but was enjoying my break, like being in the eye of a storm I knew it wouldn't last.

The walking and kicking routine became more frequent, the boy was calmer after he returns but the kicking would start up again eventually, then the man would take the boy for his walk and a cycle was established until Geoffry finally fell asleep 1/2 hr before landing.

My question for those out there is: when I've done all I thought was possible - My seat was not inclined to allow him easy access, I've already politely expressed my distressed to an equally distressed mother who knew her child was misbehaving but can't seem to get him to stop.

"what should I do when I'm at the end of my tethers?"

Had this been a dawn flight where I'm not fully awake and remember to play nice with other, I would have snapped and made a threat to the child which would land me in a whole heap of trouble. What would you do?

Posted By Jean on March 13, 2008, 3:45 PM

Instead of charging double on the children's menu, find a restaurant that BANS children.

They are few and far between but the concept is catching on. If I opened up a restaurant, simply not have a children's menu. So what if the "families" boycott my restaurant. Let them go to chuck-e-cheese and other places that over-charge the adult menu so kids can eat for "free". A restaurant would attract a clientele WANTS to dine out without some little miscreant disrupting their night out while the parents sit oblivious to the obnoxious and disruptive behaviour.

Childfree restaurants... Maybe even just childfree sections. I hope major corporations are listening.

Posted By Scott M on June 14, 2008, 4:40 PM

I am so grateful that there are a few sane people left in the world and I am disgusted to share the planet with the rest of you who thinks it is okay to compare a child to an animal!!! There should be NO comparison I love animals but i love my children way more. I disagree with leaving others to discipline your children that is the parents responsibility If the parents are not willing to put some time into training their children then it is a shame and you are doing harm to your kids. They need boundaries that is how they know right from wrong kids misbehave for many different reasons but it is up to the parents to help them understand what is acceptable. We as a society cannot let others discipline our own children we need to do that. Kids are going to test the limits but it is up to the parents to make sure that they (parents) are winning the battles that they choose to fight with the kids. If you don't win you will just resort to being frustrated and that is neither good for the parents or the children.

Posted By Katara on October 27, 2008, 12:13 PM

As a teacher, I can tell you that a good majority of these behavioral problems in children is the lack of parental responsibility. When I meet a parent for the first time, I immediately know why the child is the way he/she is (good or bad).

I cannot tell you how many problems teachers have in classrooms because the PARENTS do not follow through with consequences at home. When I was a kid, there were CONSEQUENCES for poor behavior. If I acted in a restaurant, my mother would pay the check right there and take me home to leave me in my discontent. The consequences were immediate and relevant. I was raised to respect people and behave because that is what my parents modeled and taught me. In this world of instant gratification and other whatnot, parents are often lacking in basic disciplinary skills.

Children make choices when the misbehave. And if they make the wrong choice, then relevant consequences from the PARENTS should be issued. As long as they continue to make bad choices, they will continue to suffer the consequences (this might be hard for toddlers who have no control over their tempers, but consequences can be on a relevant scale for them).

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Posted By odrzywki on February 17, 2011, 3:25 PM

The problem with confronting parents, has been the parents have been very rude to me, even bullying. I have Asperger's Syndrome and a sensitivity to loud sounds. When a baby screams, it feels like I've been hit with electricity.

The parents wonder why people refuse to talk to them, well after enough times of being caled a "child hating monster" and being told you should stay home if you don't like it, you start to assume almost any interaction with a parent who has a loud child will result in being emotionally abused.

I am tired of being treated like a freak for asking not to sit near children in restaurants, if it's so difficult to accomadate that then create a childfree area, don't take it out on the perspective customer. I don't see why if restaurants could manage having smoking areas for years, they can't manage reserving the same space for adults who don't want to be bothered by children.

Please understand Hyperacusis (sound sensitivity) is a handicap just like needing to use a wheelchair. Many people cannot chose to ignore a sound which causes them pain. The answer isn't for us to feel we must remain at home, it is understanding. Not everyone asking you to quiet your child down is doing it in spite. You don't know how many times I've cried over feeling like a freak or a burden for having this condition.

Next time someone tries explaining to you they have this condition, and it would help if you sat somewhere else (before being seated), imagine if that person were your child. Try to imagine how you would feel if another parent berated them over being sensitive to sound. Show understanding, and you will get understanding in return. When you unleash your rage on that person, you're just adding to the crowd of glarers who feel parents with loud children simply can't be delt with.

Posted By Jackie on February 24, 2011, 5:37 AM