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Comments (18)
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Do you remember the names and contact information for every supervisor you've ever worked for? How about the names of everyone present at your birth? A proposed passport questionnaire asks these questions and others that are equally unexpected.
Be prepared to list out the addresses of every place you've ever lived from birth until now, every school you've attended and where your mother received pre-natal or post-natal medical care. You'll also be asked for the names, job descriptions, and contact information for every job in your repertoire.
The new form, DS-5513, would only be used in cases when passport applicants cannot provide "sufficient proof of citizenship or identity," the State Department says.
Critics claim the new questionnaire is discriminatory, whether towards elderly travelers who would be expected to list 65 years worth of supervisors, or towards people of different religious and geographical backgrounds. Some questions (ie. "List your mother's residence one year before your birth; List your mother's residence at the time of your birth; List your mother's residence one year after your birth") hint at racial profiling towards illegal immigrants, while others (ie. "Was there any religious or institutional recording of your birth or event occuring around the time of birth? Example: baptism, circumcision, confirmation—at birth?—or any other religious ceremony. Please provide details including the name, location of the institution, and date.) beg the question as to why these topics are appropriate to deem someone worthy of obtaining travel documents.
Perhaps the strangest thing is the part where they ask you to describe the circumstances of your own birth, "including the names (as well as the address and phone number if available) of persons present or in attendance at the time of your birth." As one anonymous reader commented on BoingBoing.com's article, "Circumstances of my birth? How would I know, I wasn't there until the very end!"
What's even more laughable is the fact that the State Department suggests the form shouldn't take more than 45 minutes to complete. Given the amount of detail they're asking for, it would probably take me a few hours to compile all of this information, and I keep fairly accurate records of my former employers and addresses. What about someone who is adopted or moved around a lot as a child and no longer has parents around to verify old addresses? And every single job? Even the three month ice-cream-scooping gig from four summers ago at a place that probably went under by now? Come on.
What do you think about this newly proposed passport questionnaire? Does this seem too personal or are deep, thought provoking questions the way to go?
— Kaeli Conforti
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Inane. Truly inane, and completely unrealistic. I couln't dig up this info if you paid me or gave me the rest of my life to find it. How on earth is anyone, anywhere, ever supposed to have/know that kind of information? Beyond ridiculous. It should be laughed out of process.
Posted By WEG on May 4, 2011, 12:25 PM
I laugh every time I see this information posted. As this article points out, the "newly required information" will only be required when you can't sufficiently prove your citizenship or identity, which has been estimated to be less than 1% of all applicants a year. Let's not overreact!
Posted By AmyB on May 4, 2011, 1:03 PM
This is absurd. The doctor who was present at my birth is probably long dead. The only person I absolutely know who was present was my mother. Addresses for your entire life? I can barely remember my last address, much less the 20 or so addresses I have had over the course of a lifetime. Only rich white people will be able to complete this form - as they are the only ones who can afford houses and to stay in the same location for decades, as well as keep the same doctor. The rest of us move for school, for jobs, being in the military, for marriage, and other purposes. We also switch healthcare providers every time we get or lose insurance. We don't have "baby books" documenting our lives. Absolutely ridiculous.
Posted By Lori on May 6, 2011, 10:49 PM
Details of early religious ceremonies can indeed be helpful in establishing otherwise uncorroborated identity markers. This is especially so in areas of the world which have many home births and where the first interaction with any established authority is a church ceremony which was dutifully recorded and the record of which was kept safe. This applies to many older U.S. citizens who may be getting a passport for the first time in their lifes. Often baptismal records include the date of birth, names of parents, and names of godparents,as well as the date these items were recorded; hence, the utility of using such a certified record. Godparents in many parts of the world are intimately connected to a family and could vouch for the date of birth of the person seeking to establish that date for federal authorities.
Incidentally, the item about confirmation: yes, at birth. In Mexico during periods of persecution and for sometime afterwards all Catholic priests were authorized to administer the sacrament of Confirmation along with infant baptism. Within the Orthodox Christian tradition Chrismation is routinely administered at baptism.
Posted By Maureen Tilley on May 9, 2011, 10:17 AM
The article states that citizens who can't show "sufficient proof of citizenship or identity" will be required to fill out additional forms. I thinks this is a wise move. If you have a US birth certificate or a US naturalization document, I suspect you should not have any issues with the standard form. I don't see the problem here. Ms. Tilley obviously glossed over this point in order to make hers.
Posted By John from Dallas on May 9, 2011, 10:47 AM
If you can't prove your U.S. citizenship, should you really be entitled to a U.S. passport, anyway? Seems like our government is once again skirting around the real issue of illegal immigration. Why doesn't our government create a "form" to help people gain legal citizenship, first. Then there would be no need for this proposed DS-5513.
Posted By S. Howarad on May 9, 2011, 1:00 PM
Expecting ANY person (ability to prove citizenship or identity notwithstanding) to remember EVERY address and job is unnecessary. The government can get this info through credit reporting agencies, the IRS and the Social Security Administration- it's part of these entities' jobs to know where one has lived and worked. The passport agency will probably need to contact these places to verify the info, anyway... or are they putting those people who need to provide this extra info on the honor system?
Posted By Poppy H. on May 9, 2011, 1:02 PM
I agree, let's not get ahead of ourselves here. This form is for people that cannot provide sufficient proof of citizenship, not for all passport applicants. When I came to the U.S. and then applied for citizenship, I had to provide all sorts of info. Which I luckily had, birth certificate and the like. However, when my grandmother came (about 5 years before me) she could not. The reason, she was born in some small town in Poland, only "Registration of birth" was her baptism at the church. A home birth. So the church was the only place that had any record of her existence. Then during WWII a lot of the churches were burned, so all of the records are gone. She had no way to prove she was born. But obviously she was, so when she applied for citizenship the people actually investigated her claim that the church was burned down. I guess they have a list of known churches in Poland and if they had contact with them or know from previous experience that they were attacked, and saw that she wasn't lying. They then asked for additional paperwork, and letters from her previous employers. I don't recall what else, but she did have to jump through additional hoops to get her citizenship and it seemed only right. They can't take people at their word, and do the honor system.
@Poppy - I have worked for various agencies under Uncle Sam, and let me tell you. They DON'T communicate with each other. It's like pulling teeth. I worked for one agency under Department of Homeland Security (at least that's what it's under now) then I transferred to another agency under the same department. They didn't even know it. My new boss was confused as to why my seniority date was different then my start date with his agency. Communication would solve many problems, but that would be the common sense approach. Which I noticed, with almost 15 years of federal employment experience is completely frowned upon. Like one of our standard forms, because of trying to cut down on paper used some forms have been reduced in length. Instead of a 10 page form, it's now 6. But when it was 10 pages you had to make 3 copies for different departments. Now at 6 pages, you need to make 4 copies. What? How is that cutting down on paper usage. Did I miss something?
Posted By Joanna on May 9, 2011, 1:38 PM
They are nuts.
Posted By Warren Pugh on May 9, 2011, 10:06 PM
""List your mother's residence"... hint at racial profiling"
Does the author know what racial profiling is? That question if asked to everyone exhibits ZERO racial profiling. Does the question affect illegal immigrants more? yes. Are Hispanic people affected on average more than Caucasian? I would guess so. So isn't it racial profiling? NO, not at all.
Racial profiling is a huge problem in our society; it happens when ethnicities are targeted by enforcement based on their respective ethnicity. If police only pull over African Americans to look for criminals it is wrong, but if they pulled over everyone it would be fine-although stricter than we are use to. This is a case of the latter.
If you disagree with current immigration and illegal-immigrant laws it is one thing. Yes racial profiling is currently practiced off and on the record, but don't throw all attempts by our executive branch to enforce our immigration laws as racist in nature.
Posted By DubP on May 9, 2011, 11:18 PM
surley our goverment has lost its mind on this one,passports are supposed to be for our protection and id, not a full transfusion of higtory for the goverment.
Posted By linda pfaender on May 10, 2011, 1:09 AM
I can't help thinking that this is April 1st and this is a joke. How would anyone know who was present at his own birth? Sure my birth certificate says that I was born at St. Mary's Hospital and yes, I was definitely there when I was born, but I don't remember anything about it. I would be suspicious of someone who said he did remember.
Posted By Kevin on May 10, 2011, 8:31 PM
I don't know anyone who can't get his Birth Certificate---including my father who is 97 (born at home) and came to this country when he was 13. If you can't prove you are a citizen then maybe you shouldn't have an American passport. I don't know many people older then my father who are planning on starting to travel out of the country. Cirumstances of your birth could refer to home births and the questions make sense in that scenerio. There is no reason to be given a passport unless you can prove without a doubt who you are. Sorry---If you can't prove your citizenship then no passport. An American Passport is a valuable thing.
Posted By rosalie greer on May 11, 2011, 12:43 AM
I had to fill out a form similar to this when I applied for my passport recently. I did the standard application at the post office with proper I.D. and photos. Weeks later I got a 6 page questionaire in the mail from the dept of state seeking my life history from birth: Jobs, Schools, Residence, Hospitals, Baptism, Family History, and other information. I was furious at first. If it helps fight illegal immigration than I'm OK with it.
Posted By Brad on May 12, 2011, 11:10 AM
Heaven help me if I needed to fill this out as an adopted navy brat I wouldn't have half the information and the other information would be the size of a phone book.
Posted By CrysG on May 22, 2011, 7:55 PM
This illustrates a larger problem we have with the myriad of government agencies that are overstaffed with career bureaucrats. They apparently have little knowledge of the real world and obviously no experience in it. Overkill is their game and they have gotten pretty good at it.
Posted By NJ Traveler on May 23, 2011, 6:22 PM
The whole thing is ridiculous. I am 81, born in New York City in a city hospital. I would have only a vague idea of how to go about this. How about using my passport? That has worked for the past 40 years in all 124 countries that I have visited---with no problems.
Posted By Norma R. Hairston on May 26, 2011, 12:48 PM
More overreach by the National Security State. Paranoid, fascistic, security-obsessed demands are the name of the game. My father -- a legal immigrant whose village was bombed to smithereens during WWII -- could never have gotten a passport under these regulations.
Posted By Lisa Simeone on May 31, 2011, 4:37 PM